NBA Chat, Do we have a season? We may have a season... TOPIC OPTIONS

[Tre]

The NHL is doing great in places like Boston, Toronto, Chicago, pretty much original 6 cities. Ask Atlanta Thrashers fans how good they're doing. That situation is mainly the teams fault because the predators have really settled in nicely in Nashville and people seem to love em down there. Having a pro team in Raleigh? Columbus? The Florida teams can't sell out playoff games. The Coyotes situation was laughable. Do the Islanders have any fans anymore? Sprinkle in the fact they still have the worst TV deal of all 4 major sports and a commisioner that makes Bud Selig look completely competant, they still got a way to go before they reach the popularity of even the NBA in this country.

Far as the NBA, this reminds me a bit of the 94 baseball situation. Reinsdorf had a White Sox team that probably would have won the World Series that year. He was one of the main owners behind the termination of that season. He directly went against his own team winning and fans interest. Contraction has been kicked around during these negotiations. The union isn't going to want to lose jobs, but if certain cities can't generate revenue and they can't find cities to move to that will support them, not sure how many other options there are.

[Hitman]

And we're back. Season stars on Christmas Day.

[SparksALot]

What a ton of utter horse-shit. The deal they are making could have been made months ago. Oh well, at least there will be NBA soon. It would not have been cool after the NFL season if there was only hockey around. Not anything bad about the sport, but the unbalanced schedules suck. Going a day or two with maybe one or two box scores to look at in the morning? Fuck that noise!

[Tre]

Finally! Bulls/Lakers X-Mas day

[Hitman]

This works out well for the geriatric Celtics. Maybe they won't all be in wheelchairs by the time the playoffs roll around. Well Pierce will be, but hopefully no one else.

[Antoine3323]

I havent looked at the details of the deal yet, but just saw the headline. So happy! I was really convinced there would be no season. It's going to make xmas day that much better now

[SparksALot]

This works out well for the geriatric Celtics.

Works out for the Lakers too. (although they probably lose on Christmas day with no Bynum) They aren't as ancient as the Celtics, but having that extra rest for Kobe, Fish, and even Gasol will help a lot. Plus this will probably be the closest Bynum ever gets to playing a full season

[Age]

Finally! basketball!!

[SparksALot]

Oh-ho-ho! Jim Buss (Jerry's kid and day-to-day operations guy) has finally dropped his "Never trade Bynum" stance for the "right deal". That basically means if either Dwight Howard or CP3 is available Bynum is basically gone. I'm all for it. About time Buss realizes that while Bynum is young and a very nice player, Howard is elite.

Or not, as far as CP3. He just requested a trade to New York. So bring on Superman #2 to LA. Woot!

This post has been edited by SparksALot: Dec 1 2011, 12:13 PM

[samojed]

God I hope that doesn't happen, I can't stand Howard. Not sure why, though.

[Batman41]

I would have loved to have seen Mark Cuban work something out for CP3, but looks like the inevitable that he will end up with the Knicks. As far as Dwight Howard to the Lakers the Lakers could trade picks and Bynum for Howard and still come out on top of this deal. Like Sparks mentioned above that yes Bynum is a good player and younger, but I dont even think he is in the same Category as Howard. Having Kobe and Howard together will be just like the Lakers from the Shaq era maybe even better. After all these Big 3's forming I am glad to at least say that I am ecstatic to see my Mavericks and favorite player to get at least (1) ring, the road will only be that much tougher now.

[SparksALot]

God I hope that doesn't happen

Yeah cause the last time they got a goofy, dominant center from the Magic who called himself "Superman" it didn't work out well at all...

[samojed]

Oh, I'm sure that single move would put an end to the season and placed the title in the Lakers' pocket. But, to me, Shaq was one of a kind. He had style and it was impossible to hate the guy even when he acted like a jerk (which wasn't that infrequent). Howard, on the other hand, is just vacuous, no charisma whatsoever, just artificially inflated ego with little to back it up. He may be the most dominant centre in the league, but I just don't see that kind of guy worthy of carrying the Lakers' torch for the next eight years or so.

[Antoine3323]

I dont think the Magic will consider trading Howard until later in the season though. They are going to try to do everything in their power to make him stay. If they cut Arenas (using this "amnesty" clause), they have a nice cap space cushion to go out and make a big move to help out Howard. Im curious to see how it all plays out. I hope Howard does somehow end up in LA. That would pretty much guarantee Kobe probably 2 more rings

On another note, I really hope the Lakers cut Ron Ron. He just isnt anywhere near as effective on the defensive end as he used to be, and his lack of offense doesn't make up for it. I can't think of a good replacement right now, but there's gotta be someone out there

[SparksALot]

The Hornets are reporting they reached a deal with the Lakers. Hornets get Odom and Bynum, Lakers get Chris Paul.

TBH, dunno if I like that... I mean, yeah CP3, but Gasol as full-time center... unless they flip him for Howard. Still...wow.

Edit: Some reports are saying Gasol and Odom, with perhaps Okafor and Ariza coming back. Also say something about a Howard trade as well?! What is going on here? Are the Lakers really about to get Chris Paul and Dwight Howard?

Edit2: Not hearing anything else about Howard, may have just been speculation. The trade is three teams apparently, Gasol goes to the Rockets, Paul to the Lakers, and Odom, Luis Scola, and Kevin Martin to the Hornets.

This post has been edited by SparksALot: Dec 8 2011, 3:28 PM

[Antoine3323]

Yea, that was pretty crazy. I was scouring the internet like a mad man when reports first started to leak. I would not have been happy at all if the initial reports were true about including Bynum in the trade. Right now, I'm okay with it, but not that excited. They are going to have to make some more moves to get big men now. Still, they are reportedly looking to try to get Howard. We'll see how that goes

[Jay]

What a shitty trade for the Hornets.

[JGNRN]

Could turn out bad for the Lakers too. Bynum has problems staying healthy, so does Paul. Kobe isn't getting any younger. Gasol deserves more credit for the two rings they won. He was awful last year in the playoffs but is definitely under appreciated.

There's a rumour going around Denver is going to pay MAX to keep Nene.

[SparksALot]

Crazy. Since the NBA currently owns the Hornets the other owners bitched out David Stern and pressured him to rescind the trade, and he did. Trade will not go through, and none will go through to any team such as the Celtics or the Knicks. Basically the NBA owners thought it looked bad after the lockout in which they bitched about competitive balance. So better put the screws to NO and force them to watch Paul walk next year? Lame.

Oh well, I wasn't a big fan of the trade anyhow. I'd much rather see them trade Bynum and Odom for Howard and see Mike Brown implement this Twin Towers offense he keep talking about with Gasol and Howard.

[samojed]

Holy shit, what an emotional rollercoster Gasol must have just gone through!

[Antoine3323]

Such a bad move by David Stern. Not only is it bad PR, it is poor business decision. The Hornets were looking to come out great on this trade. It would have improved their roster overall and made the franchise much more appealing for a potential buyer. Is he really trying to sell this team?

I have mixed emotions now about the trade. I'm happy to not have traded Odom and Gasol because I think Odom will be key in a potential Howard trade. However, it seems like there was potential for the Lakers to swing both if the trade went through. I would have been curious to see what happened. Although, if the Lakers can now just trade for Howard at some point this season, maybe they can convince Paul to sign as a free agent next season without losing all those pieces. Who knows? I guess, at this point, it's all speculation.

I will say one thing though. Jerry Buss does not like to be told what to do. He's going to make a big splash one way or another

This post has been edited by Antoine3323: Dec 8 2011, 9:07 PM

[JGNRN]

Chris Paul isn't going to report to training camp now and word is that Howard is going to ask for a trade to go to...




New Jersey. WTF?!

[Jay]

“Commissioner,

It would be a travesty to allow the Lakers to acquire Chris Paul in the apparent trade being discussed.

This trade should go to a vote of the 29 owners of the Hornets.

Over the next three seasons this deal would save the Lakers approximately $20 million in salaries and approximately $21 million in luxury taxes. That $21 million goes to non-taxpaying teams and to fund revenue sharing.

I cannot remember ever seeing a trade where a team got by far the best player in the trade and saved over $40 million in the process. And it doesn’t appear that they would give up any draft picks, which might allow to later make a trade for Dwight Howard. (They would also get a large trade exception that would help them improve their team and/or eventually trade for Howard.) When the Lakers got Pau Gasol (at the time considered an extremely lopsided trade) they took on tens of millions in additional salary and luxury tax and they gave up a number of prospects (one in Marc Gasol who may become a max-salary player).

I just don’t see how we can allow this trade to happen.

I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way that I do.

When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals?

Please advise….

Dan G.”

[SparksALot]

Dan Gilbert should be forced to sell his team and get the fuck out of the NBA. Now I am not saying this specifically because of this trade issue. I'm not even bitter about this, I'm glad it didn't happen. That said, ever since the LeBron issue Gilbert has acted like a petulant child who got his candy taken away. Except now he's making things miserable for everyone but the candy thief. He thinks he can tell teams how to run their organization? What a fucking baby. Now CP3 is going to likely sit out part of the season, the Hornets are going to be worse off, the Rockets are going to be worse off, and guess what Dan? The Lakers are still going to beat the ever-living fuck of you pathetic excuse of a team because you were to busy crying into your wife's lap after LeBron spurned you to actually try and field a competitive team.

I think this guy doesn't get the fact that "competitive balance" doesn't mean bringing all the other teams down to your sorry ass' standards. I can see why LeBron left, what a whiny bitch for a billionaire.

The NBA fucked up big time here. Instead of having a ton of huge press and hype going into the season thus wiping away much of the bad will caused by the lockout, they now have a giant neon reminder of it. The league knew about he negotiations for this deal the entire time, and then nix it only after it's done because of Dan Gilbert? Who gives a fuck about Dan Gilbert or his team?

Oh and the Howard report is coming from Chris Boussard from ESPN, so that can be looked at a bit dubiously. That guy isn't known for being the most accurate, more for trying to be the first to break a story, no matter how fuzzy his details may be. Plus that doesn't change the fact the Lakers have the better deal. Bynum/Odom is better than any package of Brook Lopez and draft picks the Nets can come up with. If I'm a betting man, I bet Jerry Buss is fucking FURIOUS right now and he does everything he can to get Howard. The NBA can't nix a trade between two teams that aren't owned by the league.

Oh, and who says Phil Jackson isn't a prophet, these quotes were taken from him right after the NBA purchased the Hornets (from BasketballTalk.com):

"The [Hornets] were recently bought by the NBA, which prompted Jackson to say: “Not happy about that.”

Jackson put forth a scenario where Hornets star Chris Paul might revive his demand for a trade, and Jackson wondered how the league could manage being the one deciding which other franchise would get Paul.

“Who’s going to pull the button on it?” Jackson asked. “When Chris says he has to be traded, how’s that going to go? … Someone’s going to have to make a very nonjudgmental decision on that part that’s not going to irritate anyone else in the league.”"

This post has been edited by SparksALot: Dec 9 2011, 5:31 AM

[Fitz]

Stern blocking the trade, at the behest of Dan Gilbert & Co. or otherwise, does not make much sense because Paul is a free agent after this season. Paul has made it clear he's not going to re-sign with the Hornets so what does the team and the NBA by not getting value for him before he walks in free agency?

I understand why Gilbert is pissed that another superstar is going to all but dictate which team he plays for, but if Gilbert felt so righteous about that issue then they should have fought harder for competitive balance during the lockout. Instead the owners took the easy way out and accepted greater revenue without addressing competitive balance.

[SparksALot]

^Exactly. The lockout was about money, pulling the competitive balance card was a bunch of bullshit. Also, reading about it in the aftermath today, most people agree the trade was a bad one for the Lakers! It was entirely dependent on them being able to trade Bynum for Howard. But it's becoming increasingly evident that Dan Gilbert actually doesn't know much about the actual GAME of basketball. "The Lakers didn't give up enough." he says because they didn't give up draft picks. Dude would give up half his sorry ass team to have Odom and Gasol on it.

[Jay]

Well as has been said or alluded to, this is exactly why the league shouldn't own teams. There is just a serious conflict of interest. I don't actually blame the rest of the owners for not wanting this deal to happen. Why would they? No one has to agree with any of their reasons, but they are valid reasons to not want the deal to go down from their perspective and they are in a position to do something about it. So why wouldn't they?

Stern is a scapegoat here. He's totally deserving of all the hatred in the world on a number of things, but at the end of the day, the problem is too many hands in the cookie jar. I would HOPE the Celtics owners chimed in and wanted the deal nixed. I mean, why wouldn't they?

[SparksALot]

No you are right, my problem with Gilbert is he hides behind this veil of competitive balance, and in his notes he starts going over the Laker's finances. Like that's any of his goddamned business. Nix the trade? Fine. But don't start telling one of the premier teams in the league, one of the teams along with the Celtics, Bulls, and Knicks that have kept this league afloat through many rough years, how to fucking run their business.

But like I said, you are right. As I said earlier the league let this happen, and it lies on Stern. Thing is, what do you do now? Let Paul sit out? It's not like they can trade him now without looking like giant hypocrites. Plus are they going to get as good a deal? That's the most idiotic thing, it was a really good deal! It gave them 3 very good players and a 1st round pick (one that would have actually likely been better than the one from the Lakers Gilbert was clamoring for), and gave them enough cap space to go and try and sign a guy like Nene.

The NBA is run by retards.

[SparksALot]

So this is funny.... the Lakers, Rockets, and Hornets (at least the execs that actually run the team) are appealing Stern's decision. The Hornets are trying to find a way to "sweeten the deal", although most everyone I've seen from ESPN to SI to Yahoo to BBT all agree it was a pretty fair trade and ultimately the Lakers may be worse off as a team with it going down. Stern recently commented that it was due to the Hornets not having Paul as being "detrimental to the value of the franchise." It seems Stern doesn't understand that he's gone PERIOD, and that getting nothing for him is more detrimental.

Also, thanks to the new rules the very same owners who are raging against this trade made sure to put in place during the lockout negotiations, Paul stands to lose $30-40MM if a trade is not allowed. So he and the players union has now gotten lawyers, and plan to sue the league.

[Jay]

He has no leg to stand on. He unfortunately plays for a team that is owned by the league, he is under contract for one more year and his union just collectively bargained for the rules that he now faces. If he played for any other team and the trade did not involve the Hornets, Stern couldn't have done shit. At the end of the day, Stern is the representative of the league and he essentially has final say over what happens in New Orleans.

It sucks to be Chris Paul in this situation, but it is what it is. Victim of circumstances.

As for Gilbert complaining about another business making a good business decision... I mean, that just speaks for itself.

That said, glad to see the deal not go down for completely selfish reasons.