NFL Offseason Thread TOPIC OPTIONS

[fox]

Why the fuck aren't the Dolphins all over this #2 pick? They badly need someone like RGIII, but maybe they need to sort out their shitty O-line first.

The dolphins seem like the logical destination for Matt Flynn or even Peyton Manning. I think they're gonna go the veteran route.

I don't see the Eagles actually making a play for RG3, but if they did, Desean Jackson and a mid first rounder might be a good place to start.

[Fitz]

If the Eagles could actually pull it off then they would be wise to pick up RGIII and dump Vick. Vick's guaranteed salary isn't really all that awful, probably closer to what the Skins gave McNabb before they traded him.

[Hitman]

No one should be comparing their contracts to what the Redskins do

[fox]

I do think the right team might be able to sit RG3 for a year and it might do some good, but Fitz is right you can't sit him behind Vick. Vick is way too sensitive to do that.

[Jurkov]

My boys re-signed Ahmad Brooks at 6 years for a maximum $44.5M ($17.5M guaranteed). $7M per year is steep but I'm stoked they brought him back. With Aldon Smith on the other side and a pair of demons in the middle, 49ers have to have the best linebacker corp in the NFL, yes?

This probably rules out re-signing Rogers or pursuing a big name WR, both of which were kind of a stretch anyway. Almost always better to get a receiver in the draft.

[Antoine3323]

Too bad the Browns have given up on Colt McCoy so quickly.

With Hillis not pulling his weight until late in the season, McCoy had to throw more. He was in a second year with his second coaching staff. It seems Shurmur didn't want him from the beginning, so why take the job if you don't like the players? And Shurmur was just bad at playcalling this past season.

I agree. There's definitely potential there with McCoy. He had a decent rookie season. He seemed to regress a little last year, but there's definitely opportunity for him to improve

[Jay]

Steelers release Hines Ward

[God Machine]

Saints to franchise tag Brees


FUCKING PAY THE MAN

[DaNk]

I get why he wants to get paid, but it just seems a bit shady that if he wants to have a SB team why then he feels he needs to make so much.

Word is that he wants upwards of $24 per season. Aren't they also possibly set to lose Colston? Then what?

They also have a guard set to hit FA. If they franchise Brees, they could lose out on the other two. Seems to me that both sides need to be realistic here.

[JGNRN]

Brees wants Brady/Manning money. If they give him that they'll have to guy the team. Losing Nicks would hurt. Colston is as good as gone.

Eagles franchised Jackson today. I'd imagine he'll be traded sometime in the near future.

[DaNk]

Yeah, I'd imagine he may be in their plans to try to trade for that 2nd round pick for RGIII. Rams need a good WR.

Saw this last night from ProFootballTalk -

If you think Drew Brees is a great quarterback, Saints General Manager Mickey Loomis apparently disagrees with you.

According to a report from Jason Cole of Yahoo! Sports, Loomis thinks Brees is very good, but not great. And therefore Loomis thinks Brees’s new contract should be commensurate with what a very good quarterback, but not a great quarterback, gets paid.

Citing three league sources, Cole writes that Loomis made the distinction between Brees being “very good” and “great” in a recent discussion about the status of the soon-to-be free agent quarterback’s contract. When Loomis was asked why it was taking so long for the Saints and Brees to reach an agreement on a long-term contract extension, Loomis described Brees as “very good” when others called called him “great.”

According to the report, Brees and the Saints are about $5 million a year apart on a new contract. Which is apparently the difference between what a great quarterback makes and what a very good quarterback makes.

Man, after reading this, I feel like I've done a complete 180 on this situation.

Is it me, or is that not blatantly insulting? The guy takes them from mediocrity to perennial playoff contenders. He shatters records left and right and he's still not "great"? Not to mention what he's done for that city. Does this clown not think that the entire fan base wouldn't riot if they allowed Brees to get away?

[Col]

When it's worded like that, then it's certainly very disrespectful. But Brees chose to go to The Saints. Expecting Brady-like money when it's detrimental to the team's ability to afford other top-class players to support him, is only going to hurt Brees' chances of another Superbowl. Brees should lower his monetary expectations, at least until he secures a 2nd Superbowl. What kind of money is Eli Manning on compared to what Brees is asking for? And that's comparing the legendary Giants to the lowly Saints.

[JGNRN]

The Saints were Brees only option. He admitted as much in his book. The Dolphins and Saints were his only two options after his injury. He himself said that his entire visit with the Dolphins was spent with the doctors who told the franchise that he was a huge risk and to give him an incentive laced contract only, whereas the Saints checked him out, told him about the offense they planned on running worked him out with the team, showing total faith. That plus Sean Payton backed him from the get go.

Brees book is great on the subject. The Saints were literally the only team who believed in him.

The Dolphins believed Culpepper was the better/safer option all along.

This post has been edited by JGNRN: Mar 2 2012, 7:42 AM

[DaNk]

That's true for 6 years ago, for sure.

But I can guarantee that if he were to hit the open market, it sure wouldn't be the case this time around.

[DaNk]

Shit just hit the fan for the Saints -

No NFL team whose city hosts the Super Bowl has ever played in that game. And the Saints will be launching their effort to do so with a very dark cloud hanging over the franchise.

The league announced Friday afternoon that the Saints violated the “bounty rule” in 2009, 2010, and 2011. Specifically, the NFL has concluded that between 22 and 27 defensive players along with at least one assistant coach maintained a “bounty” program. It was funded primarily by players, with $50,000 or more available during the 2009 playoffs.

Commissioner Roger Goodell will impose discipline. To date, the punishment has not been determined.

“The payments here are particularly troubling because they involved not just payments for ‘performance,’ but also for injuring opposing players,” Commissioner Goodell said in a league-issued release. “The bounty rule promotes two key elements of NFL football: player safety and competitive integrity.

“It is our responsibility to protect player safety and the integrity of our game, and this type of conduct will not be tolerated. We have made significant progress in changing the culture with respect to player safety and we are not going to relent. We have more work to do and we will do it.”

The league’s release says that the program was administered by former Saints defensive coordinator Gregg Williams, and that it included payments not only for fumbles and interceptions but also for inflicting injuries that resulted in players being carried off the field ($1,000) and/or knocked out of the game ($1,500).

The release also states that coach Sean Payton, while not involved in the program directly, was aware of it and did nothing to stop it.

General Manager Mickey Loomis also has been implicated; though the relevant portion of the release is a bit unclear, it appears that Loomis may have lied to owner Tom Benson about the existence of a bounty program and/or failed to carry out Benson’s directive that it be ended.

The league will work with the NFLPA to determine the appropriate sanction, and the penalties can include fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choices. Benson may decide to take more drastic action, especially if he believes that Loomis either lied or otherwise defied the owner of the team.

We’ll have much more to come on this one. There is plenty of information to digest in the league’s press release, which the NFL wisely dumped on a late Friday afternoon. Though the league deserves credit for not brushing this under the rug, the NFL has been forced to announce to the world that another one of its teams has been caught cheating — and doing so in a way that encouraged injury to opposing players. Thus, even though the Saints look like anything but, these activities also have applied a black eye to the NFL. It’s no surprise that the news is coming in the one portion of the work-week news cycle where embarrassing stories go to die.

[Fitz]

^That made me think of that hit Kurt Warner took during the playoffs in 2009. It was a vicious, blind side hit.

[Carebear]

Yeah, but Kurt Warner himself has come out speaking in defense of the Saints claiming he thinks it's bullshit. Make of it what you will

As far as Brees goes: I gotta agree with GM Mickey Loomis (cue derision in 5...4...3...)

I mean, I don't blame Brees for trying to strike while the iron is hot. Milk them for all their worth.

But Loomis didn't play a big part in turning that teams fortunes around by making emotional decisions. Just because Brees is New Orleans favourite son now doesn't mean that team should give him everything he wants.

I may be speaking in loose general terms here (what's new eh?) but I reckon Packers fans can tell you what happens long term when a team does that.

The Saints became champions as a team. Brees, Coltson, Bush, Shockey (yeah, I'm aware how that ended with those 2), Henderson, Fujita, Vilma, Sharper....oh, and a nifty guy by the name of SEAN PAYTON. And of course, Mickey Loomis for doing his bit over the last 9 - 10 years to bring it all together.

If anything Eli Manning has more of a case to put forward for why he should get Favre like treament in NY than Brees does in NO. And I'm sure he will when the time comes.

This post has been edited by Carebear: Mar 3 2012, 7:52 AM

[fox]

Yeah, but Kurt Warner himself has come out speaking in defense of the Saints claiming he thinks it's bullshit. Make of it what you will

He didn't say it was bullshit; he said it was a legal hit. Just because it was legal doesn't make it NECESSARY and just because it was legal doesn't mean it wasn't intended to deliver considerable bodily damage. James Harrison's hit on Eric Decker in the playoffs this year was a legal hit, but it was clearly intended to blow out Decker's knee.

As far as Brees goes: I gotta agree with GM Mickey Loomis (cue derision in 5...4...3...)

I mean, I don't blame Brees for trying to strike while the iron is hot. Milk them for all their worth.

But Loomis didn't play a big part in turning that teams fortunes around by making emotional decisions. Just because Brees is New Orleans favourite son now doesn't mean that team should give him everything he wants.

I may be speaking in loose general terms here (what's new eh?) but I reckon Packers fans can tell you what happens long term when a team does that.

Just stop trolling.

Drew Brees is one of the three best QB's right now, probably one of the two. You just listed his supporting cast in this post and you listed key contributors as guys like Devery Henderson, Jeremy Shockey, Jonathan Vilma, Darren Sharper - these guys are all guys who other teams didn't want who through guys like Brees, Sean Payton, and the soon to be suspended Gregg Williams, resurrected their careers. But none of these guys are in any way elite guys.

Drew Brees has never shown a Brett Favre ego. He's been far more involved in the community than Favre ever was. He is an absolute elite player, probably a Hall of Famer already. Brett Favre pulled some absolutely selfish vile shit during his tenure in Green Bay that made him a bad teammate. Like taking management's side during Javon Walker's holdout, forcing him to never get a contract extension, and then while playing on his lower paid contract Walker blowing out his knee. Ever hear anyone say Drew Brees isn't a good teammate?

Oh, and as a Packers fan, you want to know what I can tell you about having elite quarterbacks, regardless of if they're dicks or seemingly decent guys? You have one and you're a contender every fucking year, regardless of how fucking bad your defense or their supporting cast is. If that isn't worth an extra 3 million a year, then you should go run a Denny's instead of a football team.

This post has been edited by fox: Mar 3 2012, 8:31 AM

[SparksALot]

Surprise everyone! Greazer once again spouts off a totally uninformed, dumb-as-nails opinion. *gasp*

[Carebear]

Fox, you are right that he's one of the top 2 or 3 QB's in the league. I don't dispute that.

But I wouldn't be so hasty to give him the money he wants right now on the back of a record breaking season. Yes I am aware that he has done more than just that for the Saints, but you know as well as I do that his demand for considerably more money is coming on the back of that pass yardage record.

IMO, I reckon what the GM is doing is a rather smart gamble. Slap the franchise tag on him for one season, gamble on him not topping the passing yards stats next season, and letting the hype of this past record breaking season die down. Let his stock drop a bit, and THEN offer him a contract at the end of next season.

Of course it can go wrong and Drew Brees goes back to back and just further ups his value. But that's business. That GM knows what he's doing. Since he's been there, he's turned them into a winning team after all.

[SparksALot]

That GM knows what he's doing.

Yeah he sure does! Like promoting bounties on his watch leading to the biggest NFL scandal since Spygate. Do you even really pay attention to the NFL? The guy will be lucky to have a job come next week.

This post has been edited by SparksALot: Mar 3 2012, 9:16 AM

[Carebear]

Wait and see. Right or wrong, he did play a big part in turning that teams fortunes around. Just because someone cheats in that way, doesn't mean that they don't know how to manage a team altogether.

[MoRbId{}MiRaGe]

I am praying to God that RG3 ends up in DC! We really need a new QB And I agree that Cleveland is giving up on their QB too soon. They better not snatch up RG3 from us

This post has been edited by MoRbId{}MiRaGe: Mar 3 2012, 9:35 AM

[Jay]

I think Bountygate is as big a deal as Spygate, and with that said, that's my way of saying it is not that big of a deal at all. This is just one of the litany of ways teams try to gain an advantage when playing the other team. It's against the rules and they got caught. Whatever. I mean, I guess you could say this is worse because someone could have or may have gotten significantly hurt against the Saints and Redskins during those times, but I don't know if there is any way to really prove that. It's sketchy, but doesn't surprise me.

[SparksALot]

Greazer - Did he really? Or are you assuming? Or can you cite something showing that he wasn't just a caretaker GM that is featured fairly often in the NFL. I don't honestly know enough about the Saints to know, but with a guy like Sean Payton as the coach I wonder how many of the personnel moves were Payton's or the GM's? Did you even consider that? That the NFL is a league unlike the other major American sports where some coaches have decision making skills regarding the players on the team? Because your point basically rests on that, and that alone. And Fox's (and anyone else with any sense) point rely's on... facts.

Drew Brees is one of the best QBs in the NFL. The Saints offense is based around him. The Saints offense is what won them so many games and a championship over the years. No Brees, no championships. Period. That at least means that he should get the respect from his GM to not go out and posture in public and call him "very good". It's an insult. The same could be said for Payton as well. No Sean Payton, no championship, and it would be just as idiotic if he was trying to nickle and dime Payton as well.

Yes the Saints gave Brees a shot when not many would, and I'd say he repaid their investment in fucking record-breaking spades. He's shown zero signs of slowing down, and this jackass wants to nickle and dime him and denigrate him in front of the media and you defend the guy like he's single handled won the Saints their Super Bowl. Give me a break.

Jay - Not a big deal? So Jonathan Vilma putting 10k on the table trying to get players to actively injure Brett Favre is OK? Wow...

This post has been edited by SparksALot: Mar 3 2012, 9:42 AM

[Carebear]

Agreed. Loomis may get fired, but I doubt it.

Shawn, now you're just being a douche (what's new?). You have to be out of your head or high (the latter seems plausible) to think that the Saints have been paying him since 2002 to just be a face in the team.

This post has been edited by Carebear: Mar 3 2012, 9:45 AM

[Carebear]

And I didn't say he single handedly won them the SuperBowl. I said he played a key role in bringing it all together. And you'd have to be an idiot to discredit his contribution to their SuperBowl win...

Oh wait... ...you are an idiot.

[SparksALot]

Why am I even arguing with you? You just agreed with a guy that the man who just this year broke the NFL single-season passing record is just a 'very good' quarterback. You're a fucking retard who doesn't know a goddamn thing about the NFL. Back with you, I say! Back to ignore with you, you ignorant cunt!

Ah, and all is right with the world, Greazer is where he belongs, in the corner with the dunce hat while the adults who actually know a thing or two about football can discuss the game intelligently without that cocksucker muddying things up.

[Jay]

Jay - Not a big deal? So Jonathan Vilma putting 10k on the table trying to get players to actively injure Brett Favre is OK? Wow...

In the context of I kind of expected shit like that to happen anyway... no. Not a big deal. I guess it's just the cynic in me that just expected it to be the norm...

I mean, it's not cool, but I guess I'm just not surprised by it.

[SparksALot]

Ah I see. Yeah, it doesn't shock me, and I'm sure it happens on other teams, but fuck. I understand getting an edge, but purposefully hurting someone, perhaps ending a guy's career? That shit is FUBAR. And the Saints are dumb as fuck for keeping this on paper.

This post has been edited by SparksALot: Mar 3 2012, 10:14 AM